Wikitroid:Requests for Comment/Updating to new Wikia navigation

This RFC was unofficially closed at 15:07, October 5, 2012 (UTC) by The MarioGalaxy2433g5  { talk /contribs} with the Expanded Navigation being implemented because Wikia announced it would be activated on all wikia. Please do not modify it.

Updating to new Wikia navigation
I propose upgrading Wikitroid to the new Wikia navigation, which would change the top dropdown menus to a new and more pronounced layout. The option is located in Special:WikiaLabs. Shotrocket6 00:04, November 26, 2011 (UTC)

Discussion

 * Oppose Okay, now that we sort of know the main idea with where this is going, I'll have to say, in a nutshell, no. I want you all to take a look at some of the features in Wikia Labs. They might make for a more engaging experience, but most of these are unprofessional and easily abused. The first of this are Polls. Polls that can be placed on mainspace articles. Do you think that would be good? The next is a top ten list. All you users who say you want to be professional will never agree to this. In fact, I was once speaking to the head admins of the Inception Wiki, and I was informed by Matias Arana that the Helper Kacieh enabled top ten lists on the wiki and would not remove them when asked, which ties into the controversy surrounding Wikia's staff, the skin, and the company as a whole. You'll find that they were only really opposing the article comments, but look around and you'll find top ten lists that they had no say over. Next is Achievements. They are easily abused in what has been dubbed "achievement whoring", you can ask my colleague HavocReaper48 about his experiences with the system on Donkey Kong Wikia. Then there's the aforementioned article comments, which are also often spammed and are a poor replacement for talk pages. Finally, the ones you can rate and see the presence of on wikis across Wikia are the new chat function, which is another poor replacement for IRC, and the focus of this whole RfC, which is the expanded Wikia navigation. Don't see this message as from an anti-Wikian's point of view, but see this as my own point of view. One of the users here has suspected that I'm only changing my stance on things for fear of being blocked again. -- R o y b o y X  (Complaints Box • Resume) 00:37, November 26, 2011 (UTC)
 * But you didn't explain your opposition to the navigation upgrade. Shotrocket6 02:10, November 26, 2011 (UTC)
 * Because we don't really need it. It's late, so I can't exactly come up with a super well rounded out response, but right now all I have is that it's a feature of Wikia Labs, which I oppose in general for reasons I stated above. It could possibly affect users of Monobook or those who code their own skin. -- R o y b o y X (Complaints Box • Resume) 02:26, November 26, 2011 (UTC)
 * I know a lot of users from other wikis that use monobook, and I'm fairly sure it doesn't effect it. I think it does make it easier to navigate the site as it's a user-friendly scheme that can be completely changed and it just looks nice. It's much easier to use as everything is categorized (you can have 2 sub-categories, as opposed to one with the current setup). Shotrocket6 07:39, November 26, 2011 (UTC)
 * If you'd like an example, you can look at Call of Duty Wiki or Crysis Wiki. Shotrocket6 20:56, November 28, 2011 (UTC)


 * Oppose I don't have any problem with the dropdown menus. Actually, I've run into more annoyance with this proposed "upgraded" layout then the dropdowns. Plus, it's from WikiaLabs. Nothing ever goes right from them...Vommack 23:19, December 7, 2011 (UTC)
 * Comment What trouble, exactly, have you run into? Each tab and sub-tab can be customized and linked to whatever need be, just like the current setup, and it looks much nicer. Also, there are a number of things from WikiaLabs that work great, albeit with some inevitable glitches. Shotrocket6 10:38, January 12, 2012 (UTC)


 * Strong Oppose: I'm sorry; you lost me at "Wikia." D o c t o r P a i n 9 9  {ROLLBACKER} (talk &bull; e-mail &bull; contribs &bull; count &bull; logs) 04:44, January 26, 2012 (UTC)
 * You happen to be using Wikia right now, actually. Shotrocket6 07:59, January 29, 2012 (UTC)

AGREE- it should be updated 23:16, January 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * Comment I don't see why everyone is automatically so biased against Wikia's upgrades, especially one like Expanded Navigation that is virtually flawless. Shotrocket6 07:59, January 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * Comment Now for a fair look into this. The expanded navigation itself seems pretty nice. The contribute button is completely worthless. You can't change the community section of it either which is rather annoying. The MarioGalaxy2433g5  { talk /contribs} 13:18, January 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * Do not cross out other people's posts. Don't alter them at all for that matter. You, as a bureaucrat, should know better than that. You are a bureaucrat for pete's sakes. Bureaucrat's are in charge in closing these RfCs, no? If you think my reason is shit, ignore it when you're in the process of deciding whether this passes or fails. That's the type of stuff you should do as a bureau, on RfCs, and on RfAs if that proposal passes. Now, if you want an actual reason from me, I think RoyboyX summed it up pretty well. When does Wikia come up with something that helps? D o <font color=#2F00FF>c <font color=#4600FF>t <font color=#5D00FF>o <font color=#7400FF>r <font color=#8B00FF>P <font color=#9700FF>a <font color=#AE00FF>i <font color=#C500FF>n <font color=#E600FF>9 <font color=#FF00FF>9  {ROLLBACKER} (talk &bull; e-mail &bull; contribs &bull; count &bull; logs) 15:52, January 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * Comment When it has customization levels greater than that of Monaco? Though really, the contribute button and the community section is really a big turn-off. If only it didn't have to come with those. The MarioGalaxy2433g5  { talk /contribs} 16:08, January 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * Comment And if you have no reason of your own, please simply say "per whoever". The MarioGalaxy2433g5  { talk /contribs} 16:15, January 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * At least Monaco wasn't as huge of a drain on my computer. When ever I access Wikia and am not logged in, my computer starts lagging, and I have a new computer too. But that's beside the point. What's even the point of this navigation system. Most users just use the search box. And don't fucking tell me what to say. I can say whatever the hell I want. <font color=#0000FF>D <font color=#1800FF>o <font color=#2F00FF>c <font color=#4600FF>t <font color=#5D00FF>o <font color=#7400FF>r <font color=#8B00FF>P <font color=#9700FF>a <font color=#AE00FF>i <font color=#C500FF>n <font color=#E600FF>9 <font color=#FF00FF>9  {ROLLBACKER} (talk &bull; e-mail &bull; contribs &bull; count &bull; logs) 16:35, January 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * You are being sarcastic when the RfC creator legitimately thought this would help. If I was sarcastic below (which I probably was regarding the lack of admins), I apologize. I don't seem to be running into any issues when on sites that actually use the expanded navigation. What browser are you using? Anyways, one, Metroid has a lot of things you probably can't remember the names for. Two, it could be helpful for categories and the like. Three, we are out of space in the current navigation system. The main disadvantages are potential glitchiness (which IDK, I've never actually encountered any issues), the contribute button, and the uneditable community section. The MarioGalaxy2433g5  { talk /contribs} 17:13, January 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * If you think my reasons are bad, look at the one below. I am using FF 9.0.1, but that's beside the point. Wikia's skin just runs a lot slower than Monobook. It just does. I honestly don't care what you do, since I don't use the idiotic Wikia/Oasis skin. Wikia's ideas, such as this navigation system, tend to over-complicate things and confuse readers, but if consensus says it goes, it goes. <font color=#0000FF>D <font color=#1800FF>o <font color=#2F00FF>c <font color=#4600FF>t <font color=#5D00FF>o <font color=#7400FF>r <font color=#8B00FF>P <font color=#9700FF>a <font color=#AE00FF>i <font color=#C500FF>n <font color=#E600FF>9 <font color=#FF00FF>9  {ROLLBACKER} (talk &bull; e-mail &bull; contribs &bull; count &bull; logs) 00:28, January 30, 2012 (UTC)
 * Confusion? If anything, this will make it easier for readers to find the page they're looking for. Shotrocket6 11:51, January 30, 2012 (UTC)
 * I honestly think users will just use the search bar. When I was a Wiki visitor before I was an editor, and also when I visit Wikis with no intention of editing, I always use the search bar, and never the navigation on the side. <font color=#0000FF>D <font color=#1800FF>o <font color=#2F00FF>c <font color=#4600FF>t <font color=#5D00FF>o <font color=#7400FF>r <font color=#8B00FF>P <font color=#9700FF>a <font color=#AE00FF>i <font color=#C500FF>n <font color=#E600FF>9 <font color=#FF00FF>9  {ROLLBACKER} (talk &bull; e-mail &bull; contribs &bull; count &bull; logs) 14:46, January 30, 2012 (UTC)
 * Comment Again, you might not know the names of some things. Ideally, you should be able to navigate a website without using the search bar once. The MarioGalaxy2433g5  { talk /contribs} 20:28, January 30, 2012 (UTC)
 * Theoretically, you already can, but the search bar is faster and easier. If someone does not know the name of something, it is actually easier to search for it by using part of the name or the name of the game it's in. How do you now that this magical navigation system will help them? <font color=#0000FF>D <font color=#1800FF>o <font color=#2F00FF>c <font color=#4600FF>t <font color=#5D00FF>o <font color=#7400FF>r <font color=#8B00FF>P <font color=#9700FF>a <font color=#AE00FF>i <font color=#C500FF>n <font color=#E600FF>9 <font color=#FF00FF>9  {ROLLBACKER} (talk &bull; e-mail &bull; contribs &bull; count &bull; logs) 23:33, January 30, 2012 (UTC)
 * How do you know that it won't? Shotrocket6 01:04, January 31, 2012 (UTC)
 * I don't, but I believe the navigation system we have is sufficient. <font color=#0000FF>D <font color=#1800FF>o <font color=#2F00FF>c <font color=#4600FF>t <font color=#5D00FF>o <font color=#7400FF>r <font color=#8B00FF>P <font color=#9700FF>a <font color=#AE00FF>i <font color=#C500FF>n <font color=#E600FF>9 <font color=#FF00FF>9  {ROLLBACKER} (talk &bull; e-mail &bull; contribs &bull; count &bull; logs) 02:30, January 31, 2012 (UTC)
 * There's no way it can hurt us. In fact, it will likely increase readership. Shotrocket6 12:07, February 4, 2012 (UTC)
 * IDk how repulsive Wikia features can increase readership, but as I said before, it doesn't really matter to me.  D <font color=#DC0000> o <font color=#A50000> c <font color=#6E0000> t <font color=#370000> o rP a i n 9 9  {ROLLBACKER} (e-mail &bull; contribs &bull; count &bull; logs) 15:14, February 4, 2012 (UTC)
 * I can't possibly fathom why you are immediately opposed to a great idea solely because it is of Wikia. This isn't some massive change that will cause a load of problems for the wiki. Shotrocket6 03:10, February 12, 2012 (UTC)
 * Support - So many haters. Those of you opposing are basing all your information on your despisement of Wikia, and not the potentiality/efficiency of the product. That's your big mistake. I mean honestly, you're assuming that nothing good ever comes out of Wikia (hey you even said it). Take into consideration, though, that these guys are trying their best to make interface easier. Sure, some work and some don't. Obviously, many people hated the skin change, but there really wasn't much of a problem with it. You could even switch back to the original style if you hated it enough, so there's no excuse there. DP99, you mentioned something about slow performance? You might want to check into that and maybe get a new browser. Chrome's pretty good, but as long as you don't use Internet Explorer you should be good. But MG also mentioned something good about the new navigation: it will greatly help move around our huge database. After all, I haven't memorized 3000+ names yet, plus templates. It could very well be beneficial to us, so we might as well try it out. No harm in a test run, am I right?  The Ex  terminator  {ADMIN} (talk • e-mail • contribs) 03:40, February 12, 2012 (UTC)
 * But Ex, people told Wikia to keep Monaco as an option and they didn't even do that. I just tested out the expanded navigation on COD Wiki and it was buggy as crap for me. And do not tell me to get a different browser, I will use whatever equipment I so desire. --<font face="Agency FB" style="font-size:18px;"> R o y b o y X (talk) 16:10, February 17, 2012 (UTC)
 * I experienced absolutely no problems with the design, and the bar worked perfectly. The problem is your computer or browser. If you so choose not to do anything about your current equipment, that is solely your choice and the results that pertain to it are yours, so either upgrade or deal with it. I had to for a while and with a lot worse conditions. Try using a system where it takes 15 to 30 seconds to just load a page, have no access to video/audio files, and can't even have enough speed to load a simple page on the wiki. You have no room to complain. As for Wikia not keeping Monaco as an option, well that's just too bad. You do not own Wikia so therefore you don't get to pick and choose what happens. All you have to do is use what they give you the best way you can. The world isn't going to end if you don't have the skin, anyway. And you could at least be grateful they gave you access to Monobook. They could have decided to leave that out.  The Ex  terminator  {ADMIN} (talk • e-mail • contribs) 21:56, February 17, 2012 (UTC)

Comment: Please keep in mind it's important to remember what we're discussing here. I don't think it appropriate to be arguing over whether Wikia's support is good. We're here to compare the pros and cons of Wikia's expanded navigation, and nothing else. Now, as Ex and I have explained, this feature will allow us to provide a lot of extra useful links to readers so that the site becomes more easily navigatable. It seems to me that the current dropdown menus are actually very hard to notice and don't provide much by way of help when trying to find something. Expanded navigation allows for up to 5 base categories and a [virtually] unlimited number of sub-categories (as many as can fit in the layout -- longer words mean less sub-categories). Within these sub-categories are the dropdown menus themselves, which can carry, again, an unlimited amount of links. All of these menus are customizable and match well with the color scheme of the wiki. In my experience, I have had no problems with the layout of the navigation, nor have I heard anything from users about them having problems. With such a complex structure of articles in this mainspace I think it almost unwise to not upgrade to this more visually and functionally appealing setup. Joe Copp 05:14, June 28, 2012 (UTC)